Is money still a problem, or is it Wenger?

[IBK]

Been a while since I've started a thread - mainly because there's been little new to say. But the events of the last week or so, combined with the debate over whether this team finally has what it takes, has got me thinking.

If I've judged the mood right the feeling is that while the Ozil transfer lifted the club and the players immensely following a lamentable transfer window, and Flamini has been a revelation - we are still at least 2 or 3 players away from making a genuine title challenge.

Chelsea highlighted this week that we simply don't have a second string team with the talent to take pressure off our first team regulars, and I am worried that the likes of Ramsey; Giroud and even Ozil are looking jaded already.

Many Arsenal fans would agree with all the pundits that our league position reflects our easy start, and that we are more likely than not to fall off once the going gets tougher.

Its impossible that Wenger, who not only has spent all these years in the Premiership and Europe, but has presided over what is almost certainly the most injury prone Premiership club of the last 5 years, does not appreciate the need to have a big, and strong squad. So why have we been left short? Does Wenger's spending on Ozil demonstrate conclusively that his unwillingness to spend big until this season was because of a genuine lack of funds?

Or are there still reasons to question the philosophy/ability of a manager who:

- Only pulled Ozil out of the bag following a clearly disastrous close season
- Only signed Flamini when he fell into his lap on a free
- Continues to overplay many of his players
- Seems to make no allowance for the fact that at least 3 key players will be injured at any given time

Is Wenger still being loyal to a club that is not in a position to 'do another Ozil' - or does he refuse to accept that modern football is as much about the numbers as it is about talent?

[Dein-machine]

Been a while since I've started a thread - mainly because there's been little new to say. But the events of the last week or so, combined with the debate over whether this team finally has what it takes, has got me thinking.

If I've judged the mood right the feeling is that while the Ozil transfer lifted the club and the players immensely following a lamentable transfer window, and Flamini has been a revelation - we are still at least 2 or 3 players away from making a genuine title challenge.

Chelsea highlighted this week that we simply don't have a second string team with the talent to take pressure off our first team regulars, and I am worried that the likes of Ramsey; Giroud and even Ozil are looking jaded already.

Many Arsenal fans would agree with all the pundits that our league position reflects our easy start, and that we are more likely than not to fall off once the going gets tougher.

Its impossible that Wenger, who not only has spent all these years in the Premiership and Europe, but has presided over what is almost certainly the most injury prone Premiership club of the last 5 years, does not appreciate the need to have a big, and strong squad. So why have we been left short? Does Wenger's spending on Ozil demonstrate conclusively that his unwillingness to spend big until this season was because of a genuine lack of funds?

Or are there still reasons to question the philosophy/ability of a manager who:

- Only pulled Ozil out of the bag following a clearly disastrous close season
- Only signed Flamini when he fell into his lap on a free
- Continues to overplay many of his players
- Seems to make no allowance for the fact that at least 3 key players will be injured at any given time

Is Wenger still being loyal to a club that is not in a position to 'do another Ozil' - or does he refuse to accept that modern football is as much about the numbers as it is about talent?

To be able to dine at the top table these days is quite easy. Chelsea, shit awful not so long ago with no history etc have won EPL's, Cups & Euroepan Cup. Man City have come from being the Tottenham of Manchester to EPL winners in no time at all. Europe's richest clubs are sitting at the top of their respective leagues & we see the same old faces in the C.L every year. Money is key, we haven't had it whilst paying for the stadium so we've been working our balls off to stay in the pack. Now we're told we can finally compete & although I thought Wenger was his normal useless self in the transfer window, he pulls Ozil out of the bag last minute. In our current team we seem to be spoilt for choice with quality midfielders. This at least is a start because this hasn't been the case for years. Now we need to be spoilt in defence & attack aswell. To do this we need class players on class wages competing for a starting line up knowing we have quality cover for injuries. We are still way off this in defence & attack.
If this can be addressed, we can compete but Wenger has to realise that the big teams don't & can't rely on young talent coming through unless they really are exceptional. With Wilshire, Gibbs & Rambo in the team we have our young homegrown contingent, the rest of the team needs to be quality players. You look at players like Milner & Rodwell now at Man City, they have made an awful decision football wise because they simply wont play many games. They are doomed at Man City. If they don't win the league again this year then the owners will spend whatever is necesary to try & regain it which means world class players in & others out.
I've never really wanted Arsenal to do a "Chelski" or Man City but unfortunatley whether we like it or not its the only way now. Football has moved on. Our problem is whether Wenger's ready to change. With the capture of Ozil & the emergence of Rambo, Kos, Giroud - we really do have a good base but we could fuck it up bigtime if we don't buy quality players for all positions. In reality I believe Kos is our only world class defender, we need a younger DM to finsih a quality midfield & at least one true quality forward. Therefore only 5 players to find & we will be ready.

[Penguin]

It's a bit of both.

Money wise we cant compete with the Russian and Arab sugar daddies. Chelsea could probably field two teams capable of winning the league and City have the money to do the same. Even though we broke our transfer record with the Ozil signing I don't think we can afford to spend that much on one player every window. I get the feeling that Wenger chose to make one massive signing in the summer instead of 2 or 3 cheaper players. Not much you can do.

But Wenger hasn't given us the best chance of winning trophies even if we don't have the financial power to compete. Some of his decisions have been baffling and he has failed to address problems stretching back 8 years or even more.

[IBK]

Thing I'm wondering is whether Wenger's failure to reinforce is because of funds; stubbornness or lack of competence in the transfer market? The fact that at last he did spend some money at the end of the Summer might suggest that he is no longer scared to spend, but I do have concerns that Wenger is still swimming against a tide that as has been pointed out is irresistible in terms of money spent equalling league position.

I think I am right in saying that the Invincibles season was remarkable not only in its own right, but for the small number of players that we used throughout the season compared with the competition. I worry that the manager still clings to this blueprint.

The second concern is his constant gambles with players' fitness - despite all evidence to the contrary. We saw it with our reliance on RVP a couple of seasons ago; we saw it with his failure to replace Song; with his failure to bring in an experienced keeper, and now we are seeing it with our reliance on Giroud. I'm also pretty convinced that Flamini - upon whom our team now relies more that could have been predicted - was an accident rather than planned.

The likes of Chelsea and Citeh simply don't take these risks, and it shows. Even Spurs make sure they have proper cover (its funny that they were accused of taking risks in terms of a striker last season, but I'd say that they were arguably better covered than we are this season - plus they had Bale who was more effective than any of their strikers). For me, Wenger is a slave to his injuries - through his own fault - and this won't change.

Is it because he cannot bring himself to 'kill' injury prone players (personally, I would be close to regarding Podolski as a failed experiment, and Walcott is absent too ofen for our second highest paid player - lets not even go ther with Diaby), or is it because his 'eye of the needle' football relies upon too small a group of players being able to understand each other?

And something is badly wrong with our team's fitness level. For four years now, we have been the team consistently at the top of the injury league - and generally have key players out too. Whether is lack of conditioning, over playing or poor selection in the transfer market in terms of physicality we are doing something wrong - which means that we are not seeing value for the money that the manager does spend.

So I can't help but see the problem with our squad as Wenger's as much as any lack of funds.

[The Ogg Monster]

Wenger knows what hes doing.

So we're out of the 'Shitty Who Gives A Fuck Cup' to a team with billions to spend, and we lost to last years CL finalists (Dortmund).

Flamini was a masterstroke, its such a shame he's injured for the Liverpool game and maybe the unted one too.But Keeping him Ramsey and Ozil fit, and Giroud too, will be key to out success this year. With those fit, we dont need a huge squad.

As for the squad, does anyone here honestly expect us to have as good a squad as Chelsea and City with their zillions? No. But on planet earth we have (IMO) the best squad other than those mentioned, made up of many British players too.

In conclusion -the triple is on.

[Zerlathon]

It was only until just recently we were hampered by sponsorship deals that were well below market value for the sole purpose of getting the funds in place for the construction of the Stadium.

I don't think it's just coincidence that the moment new deals worth a considerable amount more money Wenger goes out and doubles the previous transfer record. So on that basis, I think this shows that there was certainly something hindering us from keeping up with the Jones'.

We still have a considerable amount of money in the pot from the Summer and I feel that Wenger will spend it. Give it a another Season, and I feel that our Squad as a whole will vastly surpass others in the EPL in terms of quality.

[Penguin]

Wenger knows what hes doing.

Depends what you mean by knowing what he's doing. If you mean keeping us in the top four every year, building teams within our own financial means and showing us an attractive style of football, then yes you're right. I don't take that lightly. Other managers have won trophies but failed to finish in the top four (like Benitez).

If you mean winning trophies, learning from his/our mistakes and building on our weaknesses then you're wrong. He hasn't done any of that for the best part of a decade. Only the first part has anything to do with money.

[I am invisible]

If our bids for Suarez and Lars Bender had been successful then our spend would have smashed the hundred million barrier, so I really don't think there's a stubbornness issue here - I'd chalk our lack of other impressive signings up to a) struggling to sell the club to the very best players after 7 or 8 years of looking like a selling club with no ambition, and b) wasting too much time chasing the wrong targets (or target)...

[IBK]

If our bids for Suarez and Lars Bender had been successful then our spend would have smashed the hundred million barrier, so I really don't think there's a stubbornness issue here - I'd chalk our lack of other impressive signings up to a) struggling to sell the club to the very best players after 7 or 8 years of looking like a selling club with no ambition, and b) wasting too much time chasing the wrong targets (or target)...

Well, I'm not at all sure we'd have stumped up 42M for Ozil had we already spent 40M on Suarez

[milla]

If our bids for Suarez and Lars Bender had been successful then our spend would have smashed the hundred million barrier, so I really don't think there's a stubbornness issue here - I'd chalk our lack of other impressive signings up to a) struggling to sell the club to the very best players after 7 or 8 years of looking like a selling club with no ambition, and b) wasting too much time chasing the wrong targets (or target)...

Must make another bid for Lars Bender next summer. Striker, RB and DM are a must IMO.