The Wish They Were All Dead Tory Cunt Thread

[HCZ_Reborn]

I wouldn't, there's a tendency for them to veer towards aggressive action and play with their toys, the Vietnam war tells us all we need to know about military arrogance

And so you'd like this country to be ruled by the military then?

Crikey don’t strain your joints with that reach

Vietnam is completely not germane to this discussion, because that is then about the rationale behind the war to begin with, that and you probably aren’t going to outfox your enemy in a jungle war where they understand the terrain far better than you do…and where most of the people in the country are somewhat sympathetic to the VC rather than the American backed regime in Saigon.

But people with experience of fighting Naval battles, including likely personal experience in the Battle of the Atlantic…yes I’d trust their judgement and that’s why elected politicians consult military advisors….not necessarily on what wars to fight (that’s a matter of geopolitics) but how these wars should be fought and how we should ensure that our own service personnel are protected

[Mac76]

You say it's not germane and then explain why it absolutely is:

"that and you probably aren’t going to outfox your enemy in a jungle war where they understand the terrain far better than you do…and where most of the people in the country are somewhat sympathetic to the VC rather than the American backed regime in Saigon."

Quite, but your military geniuses didn't factor any of that in, they thought their superior tech would do the job, just as tbey thought it would in Iraq and Afghanistan

And it's not just about knowing how to 'fight battles' it's remembering why you're there and the principles you're supposed to be defending

[HCZ_Reborn]

You say it's not germane and then explain why it absolutely is:

"that and you probably aren’t going to outfox your enemy in a jungle war where they understand the terrain far better than you do…and where most of the people in the country are somewhat sympathetic to the VC rather than the American backed regime in Saigon."

Quite, but your military geniuses didn't factor any of that in, theu fpught their superior tech would do the job, just as tbey thought it would in Iraq and Afghanistan

Again I think you’re confusing political and military decisions, the reason Iraq was a fiasco was because the DOD simply did not care about what might happen post invasion (and that’s looking beyond whether it was right to go in, in the first place). And actually military leaders like General David Petraeus did manage to keep things steady in Iraq with employing counterinsurgency tactics but also reaching out to the general Iraqi population and assisting with getting new building projects started.

The decision to escalate (oh and unrelated but to dispel another myth that some people like Oliver Stone seem to hold, but the Vietnam War would still have happened if Kennedy had lived) in SE Asia was taken by the Johnson White House. And then that “peace with honour” bollocks by Nixon.

The point about the jungle war is that there’s only so much sound advice you can give when fighting in unfamiliar terrain as a result of political decisions made.

[HCZ_Reborn]

Plus apart from anything else I said I trusted their judgement and experience more than yours, which is a low bar

You have moral objections to the sinking of the Belgrano. I have none, it was an enemy vessel that had been instructed to attack our ships….it was a legitimate target.

Perhaps if the Argentine military junta (where there was no separation between military and political) had cared so much about the lives of its service personnel, they’d have spent less money on Exocet missiles which did lead to the sinking of a lot of our ships and more on backup generators so that a distress call could have been sent out before the Belgrano sank.

[Letters]

I do not have a strong opinion about this but I'm old enough to remember the kerfuffle, and young enough to have not really cared at the time.
But since when, in the context of war, has "they're running away" mean you stop attacking them?

[HCZ_Reborn]

That and they weren’t running away, they were playing a game of cat and mouse

[Letters]

Exit polls forecasting Labour will get 410 and the Tories 131

[HCZ_Reborn]

Exit polls forecasting Labour will get 410 and the Tories 131

No real big surprises with the exit poll, pretty much in line with what I expected

[Letters]

Yes, no real shock.
Now the BBC have 90 minutes to pad before Sunderland declare

[HCZ_Reborn]

Yes, no real shock.
Now the BBC have 90 minutes to pad before Sunderland declare

Interestingly this if accurate fails to dwarf their massive majorities in 1997 and 2001. Which actually I can’t help but think is a good thing