Match Thread: Ukraine vs Russia.

[Niall_Quinn]

Anybody seen Ollie lately?
This just might be him
https://nypost.com/2022/04/12/uk-man...s-in-mariupol/

That's quite an informative article. But it can't resist drifting into bullshit by the end. You have to wonder, if the Ukrainians are surrounded, without supplies and are being mopped up - why are the Russians using chemical weapons? Another one of those simple questions that can reveal so much.

The answer is easy enough. The Russians are using chemical weapons because the west says so and needs to hype up the hysteria so the war doesn't go cold for the Facebook warriors. And if that doesn't work, they might as well use nukes too. Or their new Death Star that everyone knows they always had.

Or I guess they could just say "hypersonic weapons" and leave it there. That seems to get a lot of war fans pumped.

I'm thinking the stand-up guy in Kiev has one last chance for peace before his army is sacrificed in its entirety on the altar of NATO's agenda. So far they haven't seemed squeamish about fighting to the last Ukrainian.

[Niall_Quinn]

You say apparently Russia is indiscriminately shelling civilians.

Given there is countless images of Russians firing missiles at civilian buildings, hundreds of civilians shot dead with their hands tied behind their backs, hospitals targeted by Russian air strikes, are you denying these are actions of Russia?

Are you wanting us to believe all these actions are those of Ukraine and the west as some serious deep state action to falsely accuse Russia of these events?

And you say we are thick

Btw Ollie - there were no WMD in Iraq. Imagine that? After all the fuss and nonsense.

Could history repeat?

[Globalgunner]

Btw Ollie - there were no WMD in Iraq. Imagine that? After all the fuss and nonsense.

Could history repeat?

Nooo! This time everything we see in the mass media is on the up and up...Putin is BAAAD


Bad for business and bad at parking too. He parked his country over all those vast natural resources that rightfully should belong to the west. The man cannot be allowed to remain in power.

[Ollie the Optimist]

That's quite an informative article. But it can't resist drifting into bullshit by the end. You have to wonder, if the Ukrainians are surrounded, without supplies and are being mopped up - why are the Russians using chemical weapons? Another one of those simple questions that can reveal so much.

The answer is easy enough. The Russians are using chemical weapons because the west says so and needs to hype up the hysteria so the war doesn't go cold for the Facebook warriors. And if that doesn't work, they might as well use nukes too. Or their new Death Star that everyone knows they always had.

Or I guess they could just say "hypersonic weapons" and leave it there. That seems to get a lot of war fans pumped.

I'm thinking the stand-up guy in Kiev has one last chance for peace before his army is sacrificed in its entirety on the altar of NATO's agenda. So far they haven't seemed squeamish about fighting to the last Ukrainian.

Except the west isn’t saying Russia is using chemical weapons. The west is saying that the allegations of their use need to be investigated and verified.

Not that facts seem to bother you

[Globalgunner]

Except the west isn’t saying Russia is using chemical weapons. The west is saying that the allegations of their use need to be investigated and verified.

Not that facts seem to bother you

It was the UK that blocked a UN investigation into those said crimes. Does that fact not bother you?

[Ollie the Optimist]

It was the UK that blocked a UN investigation into those said crimes. Does that fact not bother you?

Given the allegations of chemical weapons were only made last night and the uk has not blocked a un investigation since last night, no

[Letters]

It's not an argument, it's an observation backed by copious evidence that's right here and available for review. But I wouldn't say thick, it's more gullible and lazy.

You talked about IQ.
Come on, dude. It's this sort of argument that lost the Brexit vote - the idea that people who wanted to leave the EU were racist thickos. It's no wonder Brexiters didn't react well to that.

Russia is indiscriminately shelling civilians all across Ukraine, etc, etc. Let's go with that for the sake of the demonstration.
Then we have, Boris Johnson pays surprise visit to Kiev.

Except I don't think the MSM are saying the first of those. Certainly there have been "incidents" - the theatre and wasn't there a school? And that's not great.
But I haven't got a sense from the media that cities are being flattened like they were in WWII.
There has been bombing in Kyiv - our dev lead's family live there and heard it. But I read in the media that Russian troops had withdrawn from Kyiv before I read about Johnson's visit, so...

You do go on about the WMD thing. You understand that the media were reporting on a dossier produced by the government?
I'd agree that hysterical headlines like The Sun's "HE'S GOT 'EM SO LET'S GET 'IM" are unhelpful, but the MSM were simply reporting what the dossier said. And it did say that.
It was also the MSM who reported on it when it was found to be a pile of horseshit. Is your argument that they shouldn't have reported on it at all until they could verify it?
I don't know how they could have done that in any reasonable timeframe.

I'm not saying the MSM are bastions of truth, but much of what they write is actually accurate and there's more oversight on them than there is on some bloke who starts a blog or YouTube channel.
Blindly believing everything the MSM write is not helpful but neither is blindly believing it to be false because its from the MSM.

I always feel you overestimate your discernment in these matters, and your underlying distrust of government leads you to wrong conclusions.
As I've noted, discerning truth these days is incredibly difficult and I believe the internet has made it harder than ever.

[Globalgunner]

Given the allegations of chemical weapons were only made last night and the uk has not blocked a un investigation since last night, no

Ok. It was the supposed Railway attack that the UK blocked. Still I wonder why

[Niall_Quinn]

Except the west isn’t saying Russia is using chemical weapons. The west is saying that the allegations of their use need to be investigated and verified.

Not that facts seem to bother you

Like in Syria, you mean?

Oh come on Ollie - use your imagination! Don't be distracted by facts.

[Niall_Quinn]

Given the allegations of chemical weapons were only made last night and the uk has not blocked a un investigation since last night, no

Have we moved on from the Russians being defeated? Or 1,000 Russians a day being killed? Yesterday?

Now we have a new thing. And on it goes. You've probably seen how one day becomes two and then almost forever.

Will there be a lie too far? The point where you stop and say, hold on, this isn't making sense any more.

Or does everything reset at 6am when the breakfast crew take the kick-off?

Ollie, Ollie, Ollie. There comes a time in every man's life when children's things should be put away.